I wen't to you murderer gmod server. And tried to hack yes. The anticheat banned me before I could. Before you deny this for attemtive hacking just think. I could have lied and said ur anticheat had an error and probably got away with it. I realized that I really loved that server and want back in. I know I won't hack again. If i do I will be banned from your anticheat. I know I should have never tried to in the first place but It won't happen again :( I just wanted to test hacks out ( I have never hacked before and never will again) Please give me a second chance. If you don't I understand. :-[
Name: UnderEstimateMe
Time you were banned: 4:30 1/10/17
STEAMID: http://steamcommunity.com/id/IveyOutlaw/
Admin that banned you: Anticheat
Why were you banned?: Hacking
We take a very hard lined approach to hacking as ICE T put it! #BYE FELICIA!
So you came in with the intention to hack?
Well Yes... I just wanted to try hacks for the first time. I realized that it was a great server and I spent a lot of time registering and finding the website. (The registration questions where really uneeded) I am really sorry for attempting to hack.
All I am saying is I tried to hack and I regret it. :OO :-[
The following applies to ALL game servers including TeamSpeak:
No Spawn Camping
No Offensive Names
No Cheating, Glitching or Scripting
No Recruiting or Advertising without permission
Respect other Players, no matter what their skill level
No Profanity, violators will be warned once then kicked or banned
Disrespect to any other player or the Admin will get you kicked / banned
This kind of sums it up. We have a zero tolerance for hacking on any of our servers. Best of luck to you.
It is just random I clicked your server. I am sorry. I went through all this trouble making this post. Please give me a second chance.
(I understand if you keep me banned)
I could have probably lied and told you that it was a glitch and got away with it.
At least some slack for honesty?
Our chieft admin and GMOD team will be with you as soon as they can. however in your plight. When someone is banned for hacking we have yet to unban someone for it. I wish you luck in all future endeavors.
rip me :'(
It was just unlucky I clicked your server :(
Do you really need to hack to play the Game? ?:-)?
No it was my first time I just wanted to test it because bored :/
>-:( .:xx ;0o =---)
I would have to say no about being unbanned, us knowing you have the cheats and are capable of using again would result in another ban anyway and our server rules state no cheating whatsoever. Ban stays.
.:xx
I got banned for them last time by the anti cheat. I can screenshare if you have skype. It was an addon and unsubscirbed from it.
PLEASE. I went through all this trouble to make this apeal. :( I promise it won't happen again!!! :(
Winner is the head admin. Thank you for taking the time to make an appeal. In the future be wiser. Cheating is a shortcut and shortcuts get you nowhere in life. #ByeFelicia
"Let em learn on their own"
Let this be your lesson. At least you feel bad about it and being honest, but it can not be forgiven here.
Our clan does not approve any form of cheating whatsoever as said before.
And I personally noticed your second account, so an IP ban is around the corner, just letting you know.
Again thanks for going through all the trouble, but you have to learn somewhere. Mistakes help us learn, if you were curios enough to try cheats, now you know the consequences. :(
Second account?? Can you tell me the name? lol I don't have 2 accounts or don't use them.
I'm tired of this! If i am ever nice and truthful bad s**t happens. When I lie, I always get my way. I wish there was such thing as karma!
I should have lied.
All I was using was this https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=186936307 I just wanted to see if it worked and I was never gonna actually cheat. Well just close the thread I know I am banned :(
Don't blame yourself, just don't do it again.
Again, thanks for being honest, things wont always go your way, but in the long run if you're honest, it's a better outcome.
http://steamcommunity.com/id/JMZ360
I had to go through something similar, just letting you know I've been there.
Cheating is no fun man, even if you mess around in single player games, it defeats the purpose of the game.
We don't hate you, we're just disappointed.
It was nice meeting you though. Please don't go to the dark side and start lying about everything, lies will only give you a temporary excitement but the guilt of that will just keep adding up. Just do your best in doing things right! But you have to no that sometimes in life there is no do-overs, this day is just a small reminder of that.
Thanks again for the 3rd time for being honest ^_^, being honest is one of the hardest things to achieve in front of strangers.
as said, honestly is the best policy. still gotta reap the consequences, but at least your integrity is there.
a question I have? if so against cheating as a clan? then why allow VAC bans? after all, a VAC ban does in fact mean you used some form of cheat. the system may not be the best at catching cheaters, but those it does catch, its spot on.
VAC has been known to be extremely unreliable everywhere, for those who investigate it enough will know.
Just in case you were wondering, my case is nothing special. I wasn't completely sure of why I was banned for a year, I first assumed for changing some files in my config for the audio of the game, then macros. I finally came to the conclusion that it was at the time where I used a 3rd party software to mess around with my FOV, but it turned out that this counted as cheating in competitive play. This went on for 2 weeks, I didn't know it was wrong to do this, but I quickly learned from that, although was confused at what happened. After I figured out what happened, I accepted it, but what I did find unfair is what VAC considers "Cheats" is not shown.
VAC is just simply a program that reads your RAM for black listed lines of code, or suspicious new ones, and rumored to also look through your web history. Point is, it's automated, so it will always be far from perfect. And Valve's policy is never to unban anyone with a false positive. Unlike other more open programs, VAC is just simply too hidden, you get no REAL reason why you were banned.
Now with the information provided, back to your original question. VAC is NOT allowed, although I was in a short window where it was allowed because VAC is simply just too secretive. Our clan like to have the "proven until guilty" method around, and for a short period, VAC banned players were allowed.
But this came with certain problems later on, so the rule was put in place.
Also I was persistent for half a year and work to get into the clan, that I now consider my family. That might be a factor. :??
Again, even though I did technically cheat, it wasn't with any bad intentions, it was just a mistake that I had to go through. If it wasn't for that, I wouldn't have know what cheats are or look like. So I'm glad I got to go through that, even if it did stain my reputation a little bit, I wear that VAC ban with pride. It's a scar, and plan to not keep it hidden.
Quote from: cad80_99 on January 11, 2017, 10:25:35 PM
a question I have? if so against cheating as a clan? then why allow VAC bans? after all, a VAC ban does in fact mean you used some form of cheat. the system may not be the best at catching cheaters, but those it does catch, its spot on.
First of all I want to say that I respect and understand your concerns. This is a very good question and hopefully you will agree that I have given you a very good answer. Second of all I believe JMZ about him using a third party Field of View Changer. As you know, changing your FOV in CoD series is not considered a cheat as long as the FOV parameters are within 65 and 80, which can be changed in the the config file or via the console. Also JMZ has been a part of our community long enough and has proven to be truthful with integrity and I'm honored that he is here. We just don't get any information when we look at his VAC ban or any others for that matter, there is no evidence there. VAC doesn't explain anything to us as a community as to what happened on the day he was banned, or when the ban was triggered, or what IP address it originated from. From my understanding VAC bans are usually placed after the violation happened on the date in the ban report. This is why we don't use VAC's system as a clan membership tool:
http://www.vacbanned.com/view/detail/id/76561198071419440
This is all we get and must take VAC's word for it if used as a clan membership tool:
https://support.steampowered.com/kb_article.php?ref=7849-Radz-6869
And we know there are false positives as with any anticheat system. Since VAC doesn't provide any evidence and does not have a clear appeal system it can easily turn into an argument and a guessing game with a lot of precious time wasted for us as a community if we use it as a clan membership tool. I'm not going to provide any specific links but you can see where the rabbit hole leads to on your own if you're interested:
https://www.google.com/#q=VAC+ban+false+positives
As a long time FPS gamer I'm used to using an evidence system such as PunkBuster with credible third party anticheat communities and very used to using this to determine what really happened when a player is allegedly banned for cheating. It is very important for me to be 100% sure that the player in question actually cheated or is actually innocent. PunkBuster's anticheat tools allows clans and third party anticheat communities to work together as a team in the fight against cheating. This information is available to us as a community in detail. For example, here is a list of PunkBuster Violation Numbers listed on an extremely credible third party anticheat site:
https://www.pbbans.com/info-center-pbviols.html
Here is an example of the information available to us when a player is banned for cheating using PunkBuster's anticheat tools at a third party anticheat site:
https://www.pbbans.com/mbi-view-ban-323599.html
With PunkBuster we actually know what they consider to be a cheat and we know what type of cheat was used, we know the PunkBuster GUID as well as the IP address location where the violation originated from.
I want to emphasize that I'm not bashing VAC's system, it is useful, has it's place and am very grateful that it exists. I just don't think VAC is very useful as a clan membership tool. PunkBuster in unison with a credible third party anticheat community system is. I support any anticheat system that bans players that use cheats. But VAC doesn't provide us with any information or evidence as to what exactly happened, nothing. He cheated, he is banned and that's the end of it. If we want to use VAC's system as measurement of a player's guilt we must take VAC's word for it and I just don't believe in doing this when determining if clan member cheated or not. The last thing I ever want to do is risk kicking out an innocent member or risk persecuting an innocent member based on shaky evidence or in the case of VAC, no evidence at all. I agree with many that it is better to let a cheater go free than to keep an innocent player banned if there is any doubt that a player used hacks to cheat. This is exactly why we don't use VAC as a clan membership tool. On the other hand we are strict and will remove any member from the clan if they end up on the PBBans master ban index and have done so in the past.
https://www.pbbans.com/master-ban-index.html
Why? Because we know what type of hack was used, when it was used, what server it was used on, have a record of the player's PunkBuster GUID and have an IP address record. And lets not mention that players have the right to appeal their bans with PunkBuster and credible third party anticheat communities that use PunkBuster anticheat tools. We know that Steam accounts, Origin accounts and specific game accounts get hijacked all the time and are later used to cheat and then get VAC or PunkBuster banned. And there is no way to prove where the IP address violation originated from with a VAC ban. To the contrary, with PunkBuster in unison with other clans and third party anticheat tools we can find out if one of our clan member's account was hacked and what IP address was used when the cheat violation was triggered.
This third party anticheat community that uses PunkBuster also uses the demo system and they are extremely good at using it. Without them I don't think I would have been able to learn how to use the demo system as effectively as we do. Our clan owes them a great deal of gratitude for this in my opinion and am able to use it as a clan membership tool. In the two examples below I personally recorded both demos and submitted them for anyone to see on our CoD4 server. All you need to do is click under Other Evidence and the demos are still available as a link to the public:
https://www.pbbans.com/mbi-view-ban-237137.html
https://www.pbbans.com/mbi-view-ban-235146.html
As far as I know this is not the case with CS:GO's Overwatch demo system. The demos are not available to the public when players are banned by Overwatch so we would have to take their demo reviewers word for it to use as a clan membership tool. I would take a note of it, but would not use it as a clan membership tool unless I could personally review the demos on my own:
http://blog.counter-strike.net/index.php/overwatch/
For the many reasons stated we cannot use VAC or Overwatch as a measurement tool to determine if a player can be trusted into our clan even though we no longer allow new applicants into the clan with prior VAC bans or Overwatch bans. We learned later that it is just not worth it in case the applicant actually cheated. We had a past member slip through the cracks and was later able to gather evidence in a conclusive demo that this member was in fact a cheater. This cheating member received his first known VAC ban after becoming a member and learned later that he had lied to us saying that he didn't cheat. Again, since VAC doesn't provide any evidence we decided to give him the benefit of the doubt as anyone should when there is no evidence. This problem would have been solved more easily if it had been a PunkBuster ban recorded by a credible third party anticheat community.
Again, VAC really doesn't help me as a clan leader because the VAC ban list doesn't show me any evidence information as to why the player in question was banned or what was detected or where the IP originated from. We just don't know what VAC considers to be a cheat or what cheat was used. Of course they have their reasons for this and I respect that but still isn't very helpful to me as a clan leader when using it as a clan membership tool. Again, another reason is that you cannot appeal a VAC ban according to this page, but others state to the contrary. Does VAC review ban appeals? Maybe, maybe not:
https://support.steampowered.com/kb_article.php?ref=7849-Radz-6869
I can go on and on and could spend a bunch of time explaining myself better in full detail, but I just don't have the time to write up an essay on the subject. There is plenty of information on the web if you want to further research what I'm trying explain here. The arguments are out there. Both VAC and PunkBuster are great anticheat tools, but PunkBuster in unison with credible anticheat communities and other clans is the right choice when using it as a clan membership tool in my opinion:
https://www.google.com/#q=Punkbuster+VS+VAC
cad80_99, I hope I have answered your questions and concerns in a positive manner. If you have any more questions or concerns please feel free to ask and will answer them as best as I can.
Quote from: UnderEstimateMe on January 11, 2017, 09:24:26 PM
I'm tired of this! If i am ever nice and truthful bad s**t happens. When I lie, I always get my way. I wish there was such thing as karma!
UnderEstimateMe, after reading this I hope you now understand why your ban will not be lifted. We spend countless hours debating this subject and countless hours keeping our clan and servers cheat free. I have lost a lot of sleep thanks to players like you that decide to test out their cheats. We just don't have the time to lift your ban, and wouldn't lift it if we did. Even if you lied to us it wouldn't work because we already have conclusive evidence that you in fact had cheats installed on your computer thanks to !cake Anti-Cheat:
https://scriptfodder.com/scripts/view/460
There are plenty of other servers that you can still play on. Just stay honest and don't ever cheat again. Good luck to you.
My point is. When I lie people unban me. (This is an example. This is the first time I got banned) When I tell the truth, Usually bad stuff happens.
I understand why I am staying banned but can you at least not make it permanent?
Quote from: UnderEstimateMe on January 12, 2017, 06:39:24 AM
My point is. When I lie people unban me. (This is an example. This is the first time I got banned) When I tell the truth, Usually bad stuff happens.
I understand why I am staying banned but can you at least not make it permanent?
I normally stay out of these discussions.....not this time. Forgotten Soldiers isn't like most clans, perm bans are done here by undeniable proof, not hearsay or any other assumption. I can also guarantee lying would NOT have gotten you unbanned. While perm bans are handed out due to undeniable proof, bans are also never lifted because someone comes on the forum and says, "Nuh uhhh, I never cheat or use hacks" or "You people just wanna ban someone that's better than you". If there is proof, you get banned. If there's no proof, you don't get banned in the first place.
Never.
Read through the banned section and you'll see that Goodshot spends a lot of time researching the matter every time someone tries to deny cheating. Two things that are not, and never have been tolerated in this clan, is cheating and racism. Accusing someone of cheating without proof comes in a close second.
Although your ban will not be lifted on FS servers, I hope that you'll use this as a learning experience, but I'm fairly certain you won't. Why? You, yourself, stated:
QuoteWhen I lie people unban me. (This is an example. This is the first time I got banned) When I tell the truth, Usually bad stuff happens
That tells me that you've gone through this process before so your argument of it being the first time using a cheat doesn't really hold water. Therefore, I have little doubt you'll move on to another server and use it again.
Best of luck
Of coarse I am not going to cheat again. I hate cheaters. I was just bored and wanted to see what it was like. Well goodbye soldiers. (I won't forget)
"I hate cheaters. I was just bored"
You say you hate cheaters, while contradicting yourself in the same reply. You even stated several times you could've cheated the system and lied in the forums to get access to the server again. I agree one hundred percent with JMZ, Cap, Goodshot, and the others that the ban should stay in place. The server is usually in chaos because of people breaking the rules already, but adding someone with the capability of hacking will not help keep the peace at all whatsoever. As much as you say you wouldn't use it, you know you could easily be tempted to. As much as you want to and as much as you try, people never change.
"My point is. When I lie people unban me. (This is an example. This is the first time I got banned) When I tell the truth, Usually bad stuff happens."
From your replies, we already know your intentions aren't stable. I'm truly sorry you feel you've been wronged, but this decision has been made by this community and cannot be changed by empty promises.
Sincerely, Hobs.
I'll keep this short. If you cheat once or 100 time's, it's still cheating... You say you hate cheater's but yet you were "bored" and wanted to see what it was like. I guess now you know.
Thanks for the responce. Been around and every case with VAC is legit just for some things we don't see as cheat maybe. Like a fov changer. I see it as cheating because using that tool is because the game does not allow you to change that setting thru the menu or thru console.
Cod4 and waw for instance allow you to manually change the fov via consol and is allowed. They do however have a setting that is between 65-80. Those who use a fov changer are using it to bypass those settings and maybe set to 90 fov. There are also a few games that don't allow or let you change the fov at all.
That said, I am all for gathering the proof yourself. I am all foR second chances as well. I also understand why valve is secretive. In part because they don't want the player to know for what they got a ban from. They only list what they ban for. Again though, I respect checking out a player and getting your own proof.
In this case, sounds like he has cheated in the past and yet claims he has never cheated. Being he claims that he has lied and gotten unbanned in the past.
I was just curious about the VAC and thank you for the feedback.
Thanks for the info. Back in the day when CoD series had Punkbuster support the server admin was able to control what FOV settings were allowed on the server depending on preference. PB would just issue a warning if parameters were beyond what was allowed and automatically kick the client if not changed withing a reasonable amount of time. Same with frames per second among many other configuration settings. Punkbuster was good about not perm banning the client for using different config settings as long as no cheats were used.
I miss the multistreaming PB days when you didn't have to worry about cheaters like we do today. Punkbuster would automatically ban cheaters on the spot shortly after joining the server so you didn't have to wait for the bans to be issued. Only about one cheater a week would slip through the PB scans on our server since we streamed to multiple anticheat communities. If cheaters slipped through the PB scans all you had to was record demos before placing the bans and submit them to any of the third party anticheat communities that accepted demos and the cheaters would be added to their ban lists. So all other clan servers that streamed to any of the anticheat communities that accepted demos would benefit from those bans. Back then we PB streamed to 5 different anticheat communities at the same time, 3 of which are not around today. PunksBusted, Airdale Ops Network, Game Violations, GGC Stream and PBBans. Oh how I miss the PB multistream days. For us it was short and brief but it was the best anticheat system ever after we learned how to use it. As an admin I was able to actually play the game since I wasn't busy manually banning cheaters. Sadly those days are long gone. It doesn't seem like the gaming community as a whole cares that much about cheating these days. The false accusations are way out of control and I don't blame them.
yeah PB itself was not the best anti cheat. like you said, it was mostly great because a player would get caught in one server, they would submit the proof, and then all other servers that ran PB would get updated and that player was banned. some of the popular free cheats would be added into there system so it would detect those.
it was also nice like you said, because servers could set up different settings to be allowed or not. fov was a popular setting, and I remember a couple that changed graphics settings were big as well. FPS was usually not a big deal for most.
but yeah, as an admin, was able to play more. in a way, why I enjoy servers with killcam. has its pros and cons. but as an admin, I could play, and then if something did not look right in killcam, I would then spectate. killcams should not be used to ban a person, but definitely used to gain a suspicion on a player. But at the same time, it gives away a position. Granted, if a player has a good spot, just need to spectate and can figure out were they are. just an extra step if you really want to know were a player is.
would be nice though if clans worked together. not all banned players would be banned. just those for cheats. if one clan bans a player with proof, they could contact allied clans and give them the info and that player then would be added to there banned list as well.
granted, being there are not to many servers these days, the player would probably already have joined the other clans servers and gotten banned. but for those few that might only have cheated on a server, would also be banned now on others even though they may not be cheating.
but this is why I enjoy older fps games. servers have admins who deal with cheaters instead of waiting on a anti cheat that may or may not detect the cheater and ban them. plus this allows for clans to set rules. like sniping only, or no spawn camping, or no tubes etc.
I'm in agreement with everything you said. The main reason we don't use killcam on our WaW server is because it gives away your position like you said. Although killcam is useful, it sometimes creates an illusion that a player is using a wallhack because it doesn't show a complete picture like when spectating. I also think killcam may discourage players that have no admin experience from starting to record and submit demos and may end up raising their suspicions against innocent players. Vote kick is not enabled for similar reasons since half the the time it's the innocent players that end up being vote kicked. When vote kick is used to kick an actual cheater, rarely do they record a demo and the cheater just returns later after the temp ban expires. We would rather leave it up to the experienced admins and players in helping to decide who the real cheaters are since they will bother in taking the necessary steps in learning about what actual cheaters look like. In my opinion, players have no place in saying or deciding who is cheating if they can't bother to at least drop out of game to spectate or record and submit a demo. Usually if they don't bother doing the foot work, they will not know what they're talking about unless it's an easy to identify aimbot. We don't want a server full of false accusers and paranoid players taking over the mood on our server. I think the false accusing and paranoia can be worse for a server than actual cheaters. We just don't need all the fuss since we are effective in keeping the cheaters out thanks to anticheat communities, our server admins, other server admins like you and other players that record and submit demos. Honestly, if it wasn't for the very few that help to keep the cheaters out I would just quit online gaming altogether.
yeah I don't understand servers that use the vote kick if they have active admins myself. like you said, it gets abused. and especially if a player is doing well. all it takes is one person to accuse and call a vote and just about everyone else will follow. especially if they feel the same way.
I am always telling players who accuse that they should record then and submit the proof. its funny cause then they have all these excuses why they don't. I think they are part of the problem then.
on the killcam. I don't see myself, that giving position away is to valid. I know that is why most don't like it. but like I said, there is always going to spectate. there is also using last stand, and when you die, your screen turns towards were the player was. also usually most players run around and move anyways. another nice thing with it though is that you can see what players use. it shows there perks.
I do understand more players would possibly feel someone is cheating. as said, it does not do its justice. those who have more experience it can help for sure. but uav could be up, maybe they saw you a few seconds prior. sometimes you can look and not see a player but have there name show up if you happen to come across them, etc. I fall victim all the time and understand. but I can really care less when ppl accuse me especially if in a server that I cant get kicked unless by admins. and I trust most server admins will gather demos and prove. why I find servers to play that use active admins, have a website and I try to get involved. and many times I record from my end. usually just use shadow play but if requested to use a camera and capture screen from that, I do as well. I don't see myself as the best lol. just can do well.
I like either way. just adds to the challenge. play a server that has it, go to another that does not etc. and I enjoy your server, need to get cod4 going lol. and I appreciate the work you all do.